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<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Matt, </FONT><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Right-on. I
meant solid smaller gauge wire and multi-stranded larger gauge wire as
compared to finely-stranded wire.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Dave, Almost every electrician has nipped off
a strand or more to get a conductor to fit
into undersized connectors. Older model charge controllers and
inverters were notorious for undersized connectors. Some electricians are
very skilled at fitting lugs and/or putting tape over "down-sized" wire ends.
I'm not justifying this practice. Just reminding manufacturers to provide
big enough connectors that are securely fastened to their equipment (not tacked
onto a circuit board) and to provide practical strain-reliefs.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Joel Davidson</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=solarone@charter.net href="mailto:solarone@charter.net">Matt
Tritt</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org">RE-wrenches</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, August 05, 2009 1:29
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [RE-wrenches] PV System
Design Compromises (was solid vs stranded AC vs DC)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Joel,<BR><BR>Changing any wires connected to a SW to solid core
would be virtually impossible because of the almost impossible to connect with
stranded wire connection blocks. Remember how ^$*! tight the spaces are in
those babies? Living with a marginally relevant inefficiency from stranded
seems a low price to pay for being able to connect the bits and pieces to each
other. Non?<BR><BR>Matt T<BR><BR>Joel Davidson wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=midEA0A8373D3754D05BAB0FF5765BC62FF@JOEL type="cite">Dave,
I agree. but are we talking about 2% voltage drop, resistance, or power
loss? <BR><BR>What I got from this discussion about solid vs. stranded wire
(1) use solid copper wire and (2) keep I2R losses low and (3) if you use
stranded wire, be very diligent when tightening connectors. Anything else?
<BR><BR>Wrenches make design compromises every day. My 11 year old grid-tied
system is an example: <BR>- Siemens SP70 modules because SP75s were
unavailable. <BR>- Trace SW4048 at 65% efficiency because higher efficiency
non-battery inverters were less reliable. <BR>- Low-rise, low-tilt angle
array because Culver City did not allow PV arrays to be visible from the
street. <BR>- And now, making improvements on a system that is working
flawlessly for almost 100,000 hours does not make cost vs. benefits sense.
<BR><BR>Joel Davidson <BR><BR><BR>----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave
Click" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:daveclick@fsec.ucf.edu"><daveclick@fsec.ucf.edu></A>
<BR>To: "RE-wrenches" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"><re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org></A>
<BR>Sent: Wednesday, August 05, 2009 5:58 AM <BR>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches]
solid vs stranded AC vs DC <BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">2% loss is significant, but I think that Darryl
was saying that the resistance for stranded wire was 2% higher than solid.
So if you had a 3% voltage drop in your system with stranded wire, you
could rewire the system with solid wire and have a voltage drop of (3% x
0.98) 2.94% at peak production; that's less than 1 kWh/yr per kW
installed. <BR><BR>DKC <BR><BR>-------- Original Message --------
<BR>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] solid vs stranded AC vs DC <BR>From:
Joel Davidson <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:joel.davidson@sbcglobal.net"><joel.davidson@sbcglobal.net></A>
<BR>To: RE-wrenches <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"><re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org></A>
<BR>Date: 2009/8/3 20:31 <BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">2% loss from any resistance source over 25 years
is significant. <BR><BR>----- Original Message ----- From: "Darryl
Thayer" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:daryl_solar@yahoo.com"><daryl_solar@yahoo.com></A>
<BR>To: "RE-wrenches" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"><re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org></A>
<BR>Sent: Monday, August 03, 2009 2:04 PM <BR>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches]
solid vs stranded AC vs DC <BR><BR><BR><BR>Yes, that is what the code
book and my electricians handbook says, but 2% is very little. I
would think that passing through a conduit hole is larger than that.
<BR>Darryl <BR><BR>--- On Mon, 8/3/09, Matt Tritt <A
class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:solarone@charter.net"><solarone@charter.net></A>
wrote: <BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">From: Matt Tritt <A
class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:solarone@charter.net"><solarone@charter.net></A>
<BR>Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] solid vs stranded AC vs DC
<BR>To: "RE-wrenches" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"><re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org></A>
<BR>Date: Monday, August 3, 2009, 3:49 PM
<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Darryl, <BR><BR><BR><BR>Say what?! This
would seem to indicate that solid core is <BR>actually <BR>better for
DC than stranded wire. Can this possibly be <BR>true??
<BR><BR><BR><BR>Matt <BR><BR><BR><BR>Darryl Thayer wrote:
<BR><BR> I looked in the code book and found stranded wire
<BR>has about 2% higher DC resistance than solid, Chapter 9 <BR>table
8, and that for AC resistance the same value as DC <BR>resistance to
within the table accuracy Chapter 9 Table 9 <BR><BR>This table points
out that for AC resistance it is <BR>important to know the conduit
system, as the reactance will <BR>have an effect. With AC it is
important to never allow a <BR>single wire to pass through a metal
surface as this will <BR>induce eddy currents and magnetic effects
into the metal <BR>causing voltage drop and heating. <BR><BR>--- On
Fri, 7/31/09, jay peltz <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:jay@asis.com"><jay@asis.com></A> <BR>wrote:
<BR><BR><BR><BR> From: jay peltz <A
class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:jay@asis.com"><jay@asis.com></A> <BR>Subject: Re:
[RE-wrenches] solid vs stranded AC vs DC <BR>To: "RE-wrenches"
<A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"><re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org></A>
<BR>Date: Friday, July 31, 2009, 10:01 PM <BR>Hi Darryl, <BR><BR>But
what are the differences and when do they come into <BR>play?
<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>On Jul 31, 2009, at 7:25 PM, Darryl Thayer wrote:
<BR><BR><BR><BR> Well there is very
slight differences between AC <BR>and <BR><BR><BR>
Dc But this <BR><BR><BR> difference
<BR>is so slight that it has no effect on anything we will
<BR><BR><BR> do.
<BR><BR><BR> Darryl <BR>--- On Fri,
7/31/09, jay peltz <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:jay@asis.com"><jay@asis.com></A>
<BR><BR><BR> wrote:
<BR><BR><BR><BR> From: jay
peltz <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:jay@asis.com"><jay@asis.com></A> <BR>Subject:
[RE-wrenches] solid vs stranded AC <BR><BR><BR><BR>
vs DC <BR><BR><BR><BR> To:
"RE-wrenches" <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E
href="mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"><re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org></A>
<BR>Date: Friday, July 31, 2009, 7:00 PM <BR>HI All, <BR><BR>I'm
trying to understand this wire issue. <BR><BR>Whether or not there is
a difference between <BR><BR><BR><BR> stranded or
<BR><BR><BR><BR> solid wire
for DC or AC. <BR><BR>Any takers on this one? <BR><BR>thanks,
<BR><BR>jay <BR><BR>peltz power
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