[RE-wrenches] Issues with HomeGrid

Fri Feb 14 10:55:39 PST 2025

This is the first time I'm hearing of that. The product line is still
listed on their website.

On Fri, Feb 14, 2025, 1:28 PM Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches <
re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:

> They discontinued the Conext line. Mo more XWs
>
> On Fri, Feb 14, 2025 at 9:45 AM Glenn via RE-wrenches <
> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>
>> Whoa, what did I miss?
>> How is Schneider out of the picture?
>>
>> -Glenn
>>
>> On Feb 14, 2025 12:28, Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> I think I have seen or heard of issues and failures with all of the Li
>> batteries at this point. Even my favorite, Discover. So then, what is most
>> important to me is good tech support and customer service. Discover has
>> been awesome. Midnite has been great too. Discover is releasing a
>> 16kwhr battery very soon. Most of my OG systems for several years have been
>> Schneider/Discover. With Schneider out of the picture, I started using more
>> Victron equipment with Discover batteries. Now there's the Midnite AIO and
>> Powerlo16s. I've done several GTBB systems and like that combo for that
>> application. Bill's post reminded me of the Rosie/Barcelona. I'm wondering
>> what the pro's and cons are between the AIO and R/B for off-grid. Not many
>> choices left these days
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 13, 2025 at 6:47 AM Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> I didn't initially realize they have the Powerflo16 outdoor
>> wallmount battery. I see you can get that capacity with it now. It's
>> disappointing that the stackable 5kWh Powerflo5 is limited to 80kWh (also
>> 16 units). Most of my clients build dedicated battery/inverter buildings
>> and need massive capacities to run their properties. I am trying to wrap my
>> head around how a multi-inverter Midnite AIO might be able to take
>> advantage of multiple un-paralleled battery banks to get around this
>> limitation. I'm waiting on a call from a Midnite rep to discuss this and
>> other questions I have.
>>
>> Jason Szumlanski
>> Principal Solar Designer | Florida Solar Design Group
>> NABCEP Certified Solar Professional (PVIP)
>> Florida State Certified Solar Contractor CVC56956
>> Florida Certified Electrical Contractor EC13013208
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 13, 2025 at 9:00 AM Amos Post via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Jason,
>>
>> It looks like the limit to Midnite PowerFlo is 257kwh.
>>  (16.076kwh/unit*16units in parallel).
>>
>> Best,
>> Amos
>>
>>
>>        Amos Post
>>    Integrity Energy
>>   W 802.763.7023
>>    C 802.291.2188
>>     ienergyVT.com <http://www.ienergyvt.com>
>>         Facebook <https://www.facebook.com/integrityenergyllp?ref=hl>
>>
>> On Feb 12, 2025, at 5:22 PM, Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for the feedback, Lou.
>>
>> Yep, they all seem to be borrowing the "delay and deny" tactic from the
>> insurance industry. It's an epidemic. Solar module manufacturers are doing
>> this, too (I'm looking at you, REC and Silfab, who have given me the D&D
>> treatment on two clear-cut warranty issues recently). I will continue to
>> give Enphase kudos for having readily available and mostly competent
>> customer service reps and a refreshingly liberal warranty process,
>> especially if you are experienced and know how to work the customer service
>> reps correctly to lead them to the right answer.
>>
>> Regarding the firmware issues on inverters and batteries, I have high
>> hopes for Midnite's AIO and MNPowerflo, given their claims that firmware
>> updates are tested, simultaneous, and seamless. This is a far cry from
>> Sol-Ark's new policy of refusing to do firmware updates unless a technician
>> is standing by on-site. It sounds like Midnite is listening, and the rest
>> are content with accepting mediocrity and pushing issues onto installers.
>>
>> And don't get me started about HomeGrid's pathetic app and registration
>> process... That little Gen 3 WiFi antenna gives you such high hopes, only
>> to end in huge disappointment. The app doesn't even seem to work.
>>
>> Jason Szumlanski
>> Principal Solar Designer | Florida Solar Design Group
>> NABCEP Certified Solar Professional (PVIP)
>> Florida State Certified Solar Contractor CVC56956
>> Florida Certified Electrical Contractor EC13013208
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 12, 2025 at 1:08 AM Lou Russo via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> The current trend of manufacturers resisting issuing RMAs is concerning.
>> The amount of work they want us to do to confirm their problem is
>> staggering (Looking at you SolarEdge). With that said, we only have 7
>> systems with HomeGrid batteries. We have had only one issue with them and
>> it was firmware related. Unfortunately their firmware upgrade process is a
>> total kludge so much so that like Jason, I  just let them take over my
>> laptop and let them handle it. It really made me appreciate Discover's
>> software and firmware update process. We have a lot of Discover batteries
>> out there and like the EG4s you can just shut off the bad battery and move
>> on. In addition, if you have a battery module that is "dark start low" you
>> can actually "charge" it (it's more like spilling electricity) from a good
>> battery in the stack by turning off all the loads and charging sources
>> (i.e. the inverter) and all the battery modules except one good one and the
>> bad one. After you get the low one to a decent state of charge you can fire
>> everything up and put a good balance charge on the entire stack. I have
>> found their support to be great as well. They also just took their remote
>> battery monitoring out of beta so now you can see battery info directly
>> online. Which is nice. I am a big fan of having redundant monitoring so we
>> can "trust but verify" the data being reported by the various components. I
>> am still bummed they ended production of the 42-48-6650, the build quality
>> was ridiculously good. I am little leary of their replacement,
>> the 48-48-5120, but it seems to be doing fine in our installs. It has only
>> been a year or so, so the jury is still out. But all the same features I
>> described above apply.
>>
>> Aloha,
>>
>> Lou Russo
>> Owner
>> lou at spreesolarsystems.com
>> Office - 808 345 6762
>> Spree Solar Systems LLC
>> CT-34322
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 11, 2025 at 4:18 PM Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> For what it's worth, they haven't said anything about internet
>> connectivity on these two systems I'm dealing with right now, and they are
>> both Gen 3.
>>
>> One site has a bunch of firmware discrepancies, and this is the site with
>> one module that has all cells low voltage. Not sure if it's even
>> recoverable. It's sitting at 39V.
>>
>> The other site has all the same firmware. This is the one I went to
>> today. One of 16 modules (2 full stacks) has one of 15 cells internally
>> that is low voltage. To me, that's a clear warranty swap situation, but
>> customer service wasn't having it. Disassemble the battery and charge it?
>> That's not a solution. It has been escalated. We will see what happens.
>>
>> Clearly we should be able to take these back to the shop for diagnostics
>> at a minimum and get them RMA'd. Requiring the purchase of a Windows laptop
>> and a battery charger is not ideal for sure.
>>
>> The only good thing I can say is customer service took over my PC today
>> remotely and ran diagnostics after installing the required software (which
>> isn't a fast process). I was expecting them to say, "yep it's toast and
>> we're sending you a new one, valued customer."
>>
>> No such luck.
>>
>> Jason
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 11, 2025, 6:48 PM Tyrone Houck via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> Yep. And the 10 year warranty is only good if connected to the internet.
>> Firmware update of every module is crucial or else there will likely be
>> imbalances. You may be able to address it as 1 and shut of the others and
>> charge it through the bus but if it's cell voltage is too low it may be an
>> rma situation. I have had similar issues especially with gen 2. Zero issues
>> yet with any gen 3 modules but the internet thing really struck a nerve as
>> they only just recently got their internet monitoring functional.. having
>> to go back to every site is a serious pain just to ensure what should be a
>> basic warranty. Best of luck and feel free to contact me offsite if you
>> have any other questions I might be able to  help with.
>> Tyrone Houck
>> Oregon Solarworks LLC
>> CCB #204937 LRT #076
>> 541-787-1366
>> tyrone at oregonsolarworks.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 11, 2025, 3:36 PM Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Wrenches,
>>
>> I am regretting some HomeGrid Stack'd off-grid installations right now.
>> There is a major flaw in the way these function in an error state. For
>> those of you that don't know, these 48V batteries are stacked with a single
>> BMS on top, covering up to 8 batteries below. Each battery module has a
>> circuit breaker and dip switches to identify the battery communication
>> number and location in the stack. Each BMS can be paralleled to additional
>> stacks with communication cabling.
>>
>> The issue is when one battery module goes into an error state. What will
>> happen is that battery stack's BMS will recognize the error, and then shut
>> down the whole stack. This cascades to the other stacks and the system
>> shuts down - fails to deliver 48V at the output terminals on the BMS of any
>> stack.
>>
>> That is annoying, but what's even more problematic is you can't just shut
>> off the offending battery to bypass it. You need to physically change all
>> of the dip switches to bypass it and then reprogram the BMS to re-recognize
>> the new module count (after taking it out of parallel). This is all very
>> time consuming and requires the inverter system to be shut down. Even if a
>> battery is not in an error state, you can't just turn it off. The whole
>> system goes haywire.
>>
>> Once you have it bypassed, you can hook up a RS-232 cable (Mac users need
>> not apply) and use their software to gather diagnostics. Customer service
>> will then want to do additional diagnostics with the battery in the stock,
>> but that is not reasonable in and off-grid system where uptime is critical.
>> One of the faulty modules I am dealing with was diagnosed as one of 15
>> cells with low voltage. The "solution" is to take it out of the stack and
>> charge it to 100% with an external charger.
>>
>> By the time I'm done with all of the diagnostic nonsense, I can almost
>> pay for a new battery with the lost labor. Isn't the whole idea for this
>> not to happen with balancing done automatically? It was suggested to me
>> that it didn't get charged to 100% often enough, and that is why it
>> happened. That isn't an acceptable reason for failure in an off-grid
>> system.
>>
>> I hate to say this, but EG4 has a far better 5kWh solution in this
>> respect. Each module has it's own BMS. When one fails, you can simply turn
>> off the circuit breaker and everything else continues to work. In fact, a
>> fault in one BMS doesn't take out the whole stack or stacks of battery
>> modules.
>>
>> Back to HomeGrid. When this happens, in my mind this is an automatic RMA.
>> They should be replacing these, no questions asked. Especially at almost
>> twice the price of EG4. They actually want me to disassemble the case of
>> the battery and charge it with an external charger (which I don't have)
>> directly from the terminals that are internal to the battery case. Totally
>> unacceptable. Whatever is inside that case is their problem in my opinion.
>>
>> I am not selling anymore HomeGrid until I get satisfactory resolution to
>> these issues. EG4 isn't perfect, but I have actually had pretty good
>> success installing some that I sold and quite a few that consumers
>> purchased directly. And at almost half the price, it's easier to eat the
>> cost of a battery here and there for customer satisfaction.
>>
>> Anyone have similar issues with HomeGrid?
>>
>> Jason Szumlanski
>> Florida Solar Design Group
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>> --
>>
>> Michael Morningstar
>>
>>
>> Morningstar Electric Inc
>>
>> PO Box 1494
>>
>> Mount Shasta, CA 96067
>>
>> 530-921-0560
>>
>> CSLB 1116835
>>
>> mjmorningstar at gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
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>
> Michael Morningstar
>
>
> Morningstar Electric Inc
>
> PO Box 1494
>
> Mount Shasta, CA 96067
>
> 530-921-0560
>
> CSLB 1116835
>
> mjmorningstar at gmail.com
>
>
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