[RE-wrenches] XW Pro Firmware 2.04 melting devices

Thu Apr 25 11:57:22 PDT 2024

To be fare, Schneider does tell you to follow the commissioning guide. 
It should be in the firmware though and should be a warning.  It is only 
an issue with older XWP BTW.

Let us know what you end up doing Kevin please.

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
    [1]https://offgridsolar1.com/ [2]  [1]
e-mail  offgridsolar at sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2024-04-25 11:44 am, Kevin Pegg via RE-wrenches wrote:

> Hi Chris,
> 
> Thanks. Ugh it's even more irritating to learn this is obviously a 
> known issue. Yes, I tested gen in bypass mode system off and it is all 
> within spec, forgot to mention that.
> 
> Kevin
> 
> From: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org> On Behalf 
> Of Chris Sparadeo via RE-wrenches
> Sent: April-25-24 11:30 AM
> To: RE-wrenches <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
> Cc: Chris Sparadeo <sparadeo.chris at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] XW Pro Firmware 2.04 melting devices
> 
> Hi Kevin,
> 
> Let me chime in here. Last year I experienced something nearly 
> identical to what you are describing. 3 ea. XW pros in an off-grid 
> application. Things were working fine, but wanted to upgrade firmware 
> for a comms issue I was having with closed loop BMS and Insight. After 
> the 2.04 upgrade, when the generator would charge the system, voltage 
> would slowly creep up and after about 20 or so minutes, voltage would 
> hit around 250 VAC with a terrible high pitched grinding noise coming 
> from the inverters. This issue burned 3 of the homeowners UPS and 
> several LED fixtures.
> 
> I was 99% sure this was a generator issue. After weeks of tech support 
> calls, a new voltage regulator and multiple return service visits... 
> and eventually one brand new generator... I had to come back to the 
> homeowner with my tail between my legs and let them know that it wasn't 
> generator related. Even after reverting back to the old firmware, it 
> seems as though the software eventually affected the hardware. Long 
> story short, homeowner was done with dealing with Schneider and we 
> ended up swapping the Conext gear for 2ea. Sol-Ark 15ks and the system 
> has been issue free for almost a year. Both generator run like a top.
> 
> Sort of embarrassing to re-read this, but if I can help someone avoid 
> the headache I went through, it's worth it. One easy test method is to 
> deenergize your entire system, turn off batteries and manually bypass 
> your inverters. Let the generator power the loads directly and keep a 
> close eye on your generator frequency, voltage and THD. In my case, I 
> found that the generator behaved well in bypass and terribly when the 
> inverters were present.
> 
> Good luck on this one!
> 
> Chris Sparadeo
> 
> On Thu, Apr 25, 2024 at 1:51 PM Ray Walters via RE-wrenches 
> <re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
> 
> That sounds like a generator problem.  I've seen many gen sets put out 
> a horrible waveform under load, when battery charging.  The waveform, 
> (if you have an O-scope) usually has a spike on the front of the wave, 
> and then the wave flattens significantly after.  The peak should be 169 
> v on a 120 vac RMS sinewave.  I've seen it as low as 135v on crappy 
> generators that are over loaded.   THD is a great thing to check, but 
> also check your peak voltage, if you have a quick capture feature on 
> your meter.
> 
> It also could be related to altitude, gen sets can perform badly when 
> they can't get enough air.   You didn't mention gen set model, or 
> whether the frequency was a solid 60 hz.  I've seen bad things happen 
> when the frequency got out of spec too.  I'm guessing a bad voltage 
> regulator on the gen set.
> 
> Ray Walters
> Remote Solar
> 
> On 4/25/2024 11:24 AM, Kevin Pegg via RE-wrenches wrote:
> 
> Hi Wrenches,
> 
> Curious if anyone else has seen this issue.
> 
> New XW Pro off-grid system installed Dec 2023. Pretty standard config 
> for us, XW Pro, 5 kW PV, 50 kWh UnigyII battery, 8 kW high quality 
> diesel generator. This system ran fine all winter long - powering 
> customer's big RV they were living in while the house is built, Shop, 
> computer controlled outdoor wood boiler, domestic loads + 3 person 
> construction crew. Gen ran daily on auto start as we don't get much sun 
> Dec - Feb. No issues reported.
> 
> Couple weeks back I did a new system check up. All performing well, 
> happy client. Part of that service I upgraded the XW firmware from 1.09 
> to 2.04, and insight from 1.16 to 1.18. Gave the system a quick check, 
> ran gen. Lots of sun now, batteries full so didn't do a long generator 
> test. Yes I set the region codes for off-grid.
> 
> A week later, while I was out of town and it was not so sunny so gen 
> running, client and their electrician called me in a panic. Two smoke 
> detectors had literally melted, as well as several dimmable LED 
> fixtures all failed. Electrician replaced the burned up devices, only 
> to have the same thing repeat a few days later. Talking with them it 
> was only when the generator was running there were issues. Told them to 
> lock out gen and I will get there when I can.
> 
> Once back I attended site, fired up gen, and could hear the inverter 
> sounding terrible during gen charging. Lights flickering bad, and I 
> personally verified the smoke detectors beeping and getting warm and 
> the house smelled like burned plastic. I hooked up my power quality 
> analyser and could see the THD gradually building to over 36%. Gen 
> voltage was at 125/250V a bit high, so adjusted that, but no change. By 
> reducing the charge rate on the XW Pro to 50% was able to get the THD 
> down around 12% and less light flicker. But it's still too high. Image 
> attached shows THD with gen on original programing, then at reduced 
> charge rate.
> 
> Have now gone from a happy client to a pissed off client threatening 
> legal action for endangering their lives & a bill from the electrician. 
> Ugh. Having a hard time explaining this to the client why a system 
> previously working fine went sideways so badly. Old guy blames the 
> "darned computer stuff" and he's not wrong with that opinion.
> 
> At another site, similar config but larger system with dual XW's that I 
> upgraded to 2.04 firmware remotely few days ago and now the two 
> inverters are literally fighting each other under generator charge - 
> one load building to +6 kW and one (minus)6 kW.
> 
> Sure makes me reluctant to upgrade firmware on systems that are working 
> fine.
> 
> Any suggestions?
> 
> Kevin
> 
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