[RE-wrenches] midnite new inverter
Steve Higgins
steve at surrette.com
Wed Apr 10 09:47:27 PDT 2024
Just remember that those are "Guidelines" and are meant to help... They
are not perfect, if the system is monitored closely they should be okay.
I personally would not install any AGM battery with any hybrid inverter as
undercharging or even overcharging is common and most often results in
this:
[image: image.png]
In this case the bank was cooked in less than 6 months due to
overcharging/over temperature.
The battery temp sensor recorded 60+ C temperatures, but the
inverter/charger never fully shut off charging.
Until the Hybrid inverters have full control over charging
Bulk/Absorb Voltage, Absorb Timer, and Control over End Amps, Return Amps
or Tail Current, and not using Internal Resistance to determine charging
current, I would suggest to sticking with the traditional manufactures when
using AGM or Even FLA batteries. FLAs are easier to make work, but we
have seen even FLA's cooked dry due to charging or battery temp
compensation issues.
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Steve Higgins ⋅ Technical Services Manager
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On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 9:14 AM david quattro via RE-wrenches <
re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
> I have not installed an Fortress yet, but I know they are made by Deye
> (same Chinese original manufacturer as SolArk inverters)
> Here is a link for an excellent instructional by Steve Higgins @ Rolls -
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJqBULN9MgI&pp=ygUWcm9sbHMgc3VycmV0dGUgaGlnZ2lucw%3D%3D
> This assumes that Envy comes with the same programming shortcoming as
> SolArk, I don't know. In order to effectively use a SolArk with lead acid
> batteries you have trick it. This process takes several iterations checking
> specific gravity, which means multiple site visits stretched over perhaps a
> couple months. The Absorb setting is ineffectual, so Steve's solution is to
> employ the Equalize setting to actually achieve Absorption. Carefully
> record the settings (voltage, duration, and frequency) that deliver a
> consistent specific gravity in range. On the rare occasions you actually
> need to equalize, you do it in person. When equalization is complete you
> return the settings back to your curated values.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 7:28 AM jay via RE-wrenches <
> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>
>> Can you explain what changes the eg4 18 inverter has vs the Envy as to LA
>> programming?
>>
>> To me the Envy has a big advantage due to it having AGS warm up/cool down
>> that the EG4 does not.
>>
>> Jay
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2024, at 7:49 AM, Howie Michaelson via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> John,
>> If you are thinking of pairing the Envy with lead-acid batteries, I would
>> strongly suggest not doing it. Even though Fortress sales advertises the
>> Envy to be compatible with lead-acid, after trying it in my off-grid home,
>> I would emphatically say that it is not. The programming is inadequate, to
>> put it kindly. And their support really doesn't have a clue about lead-acid
>> - Fortress support literally said that they don't recommend pairing the
>> Envy with l-a. However, I don't have an opinion about how it does with
>> closed loop Li batteries.
>> I did recently install an EG4 18k system, off-grid, with the client's
>> knowledge that this was a bit of an experiment for me. Both the Envy and
>> the EG4 are made by LuxPower and have been, to date, physically and
>> programmatically almost identical. I had stayed away from EG4 since it
>> seemed to be primarily aimed at the DIY market. However, the 18k appears to
>> be a serious contender so far, although this installation is a fairly low
>> stress situation. I've been fairly impressed with the system. While this
>> 18k is paired with EG4 Lithium batteries, EG4 has been making adjustments
>> to the firmware to make it much more friendly to lead-acid. If you decide
>> to go this route, check with EG4 (installer support - ask for Jarrett or
>> Colt) to see where they are at with upgrading the firmware.
>> I am also eagerly awaiting Midnite's AIO entry...
>>
>> Howie
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 9:02 AM John Blittersdorf via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Time will tell where the failure modes are. I still don't like all the
>>> eggs in one basket. Do you have to send the units back for repair? Had
>>> enough of that with Trace SW series inverters..
>>> For off grid, I'll stick to the tried and true for now. For Grid tie it
>>> is just a financial hit. For off-grid power loss it is more important
>>> to deal with right away..
>>>
>>> I am going to try a Fortress Envy at my off grid home but will keep my
>>> Outback field repairable VFXR wired in just in case. I had a massive
>>> lightning strike between my house and a guest cabin 1/4 mile away and I
>>> lost power from my Fortress Eflex battery at the cabin and my Outback
>>> inverter at my house. I replaced the control board on my inverter ( I
>>> always keep one in reserve as it is usually the only board failure due to
>>> lightning) and was back on line in 1/2 hour and Fortress rushed me a new
>>> BMS board for the E-flex and a day later and a half hour swap had it back
>>> in service, Now it is a different story with 2 Simpliphi batteries I have
>>> from a customer that failed. I have to ship them to California to have
>>> them evaluated to see if we had damaged them by misuse. Lots of expense
>>> and time lost.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> John Blittersdorf
>>> CV Wind Service / Off Grid Vermont
>>> 802-770-8625
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 9, 2024 at 11:43 PM Scot Arey via RE-wrenches <
>>> re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Wow, are we in the golden age of inverter/chargers? If it had 200-a.p
>>>> pass thru it would be near perfect.
>>>>
>>>> Begs the question: are stand alone charge controllers becoming a
>>>> historical artifact?
>>>>
>>>> Howard "Scot" Arey
>>>> Owner, Solar CenTex
>>>> 254-300-1228
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