[RE-wrenches] TL Inverters & Rapid Shutdown

Dave Click daveclick at fsec.ucf.edu
Thu Oct 9 13:40:23 PDT 2014


And... after seeing boB's email I realize that my last sentence is 
incorrect given the existence of the MNPVHV8-DLTL-3R for exactly this 
purpose.

DKC


On 2014/10/9 15:29, Dave Click wrote:
> There is some pressure on NM specifically to postpone adoption of 
> 690.12 until more products are available, so that may help you out. To 
> my knowledge, micro-inverters don't need to comply with 705.12(D)(6) 
> since there are no suitable products available [90.4]. Equipment does 
> need to be listed, and it does need to provide rapid shutdown 
> functionality, but it does not need to be "listed for rapid shutdown" 
> to be code-compliant since that isn't a thing.
>
> String inverters generally speaking would have to have some method of 
> "control" within 10' of a rooftop array, like contactor combiners. I'm 
> interested in seeing what SMA's solution is, since contactor combiners 
> (as discussed earlier in this thread) aren't well suited for these 
> multi-MPPT inverters. I guess you can always add a second contactor 
> but I don't know what listed equipment is available right now (so... 
> 90.4?).
>
> DKC
>
> On 2014/10/9 12:41, Randy wrote:
>>
>> Hi Wrenches,
>>
>> We are being forced to adopt 690.12 Rapid Shutdown requirement based 
>> on several explanations given to our industry:
>>
>> 1.otherwise we would be ignoring the life safety and put our fire 
>> fighters lives in peril
>>
>> 2.This product can be constructed from readily available, 
>> over-the-counter code compliant components.  This (is) to be the 
>> intent of CMP4when compiling the NFPA70.
>>
>> We do not want to act like an industry that appears to be fighting 
>> against safety. And we know there are a few products that are code 
>> compliant, micro-inverters (don’t comply with 705.12 (D) (6) because 
>> there are no products), Solaredge, and Tigo (is it approved?) yet 
>> this is not how we choose products.
>>
>> And the SMA SPS inverter is not going to work in a 690.12 environment 
>> without complications as far as I can see.
>>
>> Appreciate comments that might support the right decision.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Randy
>>
>> Randy Sadewic
>>
>> Cell: 505 570-0137
>>
>> Randy at PositiveEnergySolar.com <mailto:Randy at PositiveEnergySolar.com>
>>
>> http://positiveenergysolar.com/admin/content/uploads/PES-logo-3.jpg
>>
>> *From:*RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] 
>> *On Behalf Of *Steve Jefferson
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 07, 2014 8:33 AM
>> *To:* RE-wrenches
>> *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] TL Inverters
>>
>> The first gen of TL’s did have a somewhat tight window for the DC window.
>>
>> However, the new SBxxxxTL-US-22 (3kW – 7700kW, with secure power 
>> supply) Start Voltage is 125, MPPT is 175-480 (max of 600Vdc)
>>
>> Also, for larger needs, the STP (12kW – 24kW)  start voltage is 150, 
>> MPPT is 300-800V (max of 1000Vdc).
>>
>> SMA America, LLC
>>
>> Steve Jefferson
>>
>> Service Line Supervisor
>>
>> 3925 Atherton Ave
>>
>> Rocklin, CA 95765 - 3714
>>
>> U.S.A.
>>
>> Tel:  +1 916 625 3185 (direct)
>>
>> Fax: +1 916 625 0871
>>
>> Mobile: +1 916 622 4253
>>
>> Email: Steve.jefferson at SMA-America.com 
>> <mailto:Steve.jefferson at SMA-America.com>
>>
>> www.SMA-America.com <http://www.sma-america.com/>
>>
>> cid:image001.png at 01CF1CFA.FE18BEB0 
>> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQWzPuyqhzo&feature=youtu.be>
>>
>> This email and any attachments thereto may contain SMA America, LLC 
>> confidential, privileged and private material for the sole use of the 
>> intended recipient. Any review, copying, or distribution of this 
>> email (or any attachments thereto) by others is strictly prohibited. 
>> If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender 
>> immediately and permanently delete the original and any copies of 
>> this email and any attachments thereto. Thank you.
>>
>> *From:* RE-wrenches 
>> [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of 
>> *Mark Byington
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 07, 2014 6:59 AM
>> *To:* RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org 
>> <mailto:RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
>> *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] TL Inverters
>>
>> Just a word of caution to those not having experience with SMA TL 
>> inverters - the larger units (7-11 kW) have an extremely narrow input 
>> DC voltage window.  Depending on your module voltage and string 
>> design, all you need is a module or two to be shaded to fall out of 
>> the MPPT input voltage range. The smaller units (3-5 kW) with the 
>> Secure Power Supply don't have this problem.  We no longer use these 
>> larger SMA TL inverters unless we can do maximum string length (e.g. 
>> strings of 8 for SunPower 96-cell) and there is zero shade at the site.
>>
>> I believe SMA is in the process of adding larger units to the line 
>> that has the Secure Power Supply.  They added the 6 kW unit earlier 
>> this year, and just announced the 7 kW unit with Secure Power Supply.
>>
>> Mark Byington
>>
>> Cobalt Power Systems, Inc.
>>
>>
>>
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