[RE-wrenches] Oddball pumping question

Thu Mar 27 10:08:00 PDT 2014

What other technology is asked to do universal service? You wouldn't drive a
dump truck on a family vacation, nor a compact to haul dirt. You can shape
the question for any technology to perform unreasonable service. It doesn't
invalidate the cost-effectiveness of PV for substantial portion of the
utility's service.

Bill Dorsett

From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Allan
Sindelar
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2014 11:02 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Oddball pumping question

Jerry,
Your request is entirely reasonable, and my answer is no, I can't. The
request in my original message came from an online contact request from
someone who was at yesterday's PRC hearing and heard Commissioner Lyons'
comment. I have no further information, as to get it I would most likely
have to contact the Commissioner myself. I wrote to the List in order to get
a "bird's-eye view" of whether such an application was even possible. I
wouldn't want to call up the Commissioner for more info with no idea of
whether it's even possible. I'd be just another deer in those headlights.

Given all that, given that he's from the plains on northeastern NM, I would
expect it to be a well.
Allan

On 3/27/2014 9:36 AM, Jerry Shafer wrote:

can you give us more details, are you proposing pumping from a pond, a well,
storage tank what.

Jerry  

On Thu, Mar 27, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Chris Mason <
<mailto:cometenergysystems at gmail.com> cometenergysystems at gmail.com> wrote:

I have a couple of suggestions. A pump motor of that size is likely Class H
and requires a 7x starting current or Locked Rotor Amperage. During starting
the power factor can drop to .2 or lower and the inrush can run to 20 times
the rated run current. Even diesel generators have a very difficult time
starting singular loads of this size. I would not even attempt such a task. 

That said, the solution is to look at the work to be done. If the intent is
to pump, let's say, 10000 gallons in one hour per day, suggest that a solar
powered DC pump could accomplish the same in the course of a day. DC pumps
are viable speed and don't have inrush currents.

On Thu, Mar 27, 2014 at 10:07 AM, Allan Sindelar <
<mailto:allan at positiveenergysolar.com> allan at positiveenergysolar.com> wrote:

Wrenches,
Here's one of the oddest questions I have come across in years:

PRC Commisioner Lyons issued a challenge to NM solar companies today. He
stated that he cannot get his electric coop to bring three phase into his
property to run his irrigation (a 150 hp motor). He said that whenever he
mentions this to a solar outfit - running a 150 hp motor on pv - they look
back at him like a deer in the headlights. Can you meet his challenge? 

This application is way above my pay grade, and normally I would not give
this question much pause, as few ranchers would be seriously willing to put
up the money for the design and research time to work up and price a
solution, especially given that as far as I know, none even exists. No rural
water pumping PV designer that I know works with motor loads of such scale.
Indeed, it makes my head spin to think of it.

I checked an older (2003) Franklin motor application guide and found specs
for a 150 HP 3 phase motor: 128 kilowatts at 380-575 VAC at 60 Hz.

The only reason I am writing is this: The rancher is one of our state's five
Public Regulatory Commissioners. These are the folks who regulate our three
private utilities and 20 +/- rural co-ops, and he is perhaps the most
conservative one of the five. Last fall he initiated an ill-conceived
regulation to cut in half our state's RPS and pushed it through to passage
on the PRC; about two months later the ruling was rescinded due to a huge
public outcry. So if it were even possible to address his particular
request, the potential consequences could have far-reaching effects
politically.

Has anyone attempted or accomplished anything even close to this? Is there
existing equipment that could handle such an application? Could such an
application be justified economically? Or can anyone offer a reasoned answer
why it's not possible?

Thank you,
Allan

-- 

Allan Sindelar
 <mailto:Allan at positiveenergysolar.com> Allan at positiveenergysolar.com
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
Founder, Positive Energy, Inc.

A Certified B CorporationTM
3209 Richards Lane
Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
 <tel:505%20424-1112> 505 424-1112 office 780-2738 cell
 <http://www.positiveenergysolar.com/> www.positiveenergysolar.com

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