[RE-wrenches] 12V battery charger

Wed Oct 30 13:16:45 PDT 2013

Wrenches,

I'm looking for a battery charger to augment an OutBack FX 2012
inverter/charger for a 12V off-grid system that could use shorter charging
times during our cloudy late fall/winter periods in northern Vermont. Both
the generator and the battery bank are amply sized as is the PV array. I
have used Iota chargers in the past, but wondered if they are other options
worth considering.

Thanks,

Dave

David Palumbo

Independent Power LLC 

462 Solar Way Drive

Hyde Park, VT 05655

www.independentpowerllc.com 

Vermont Solar Partner

25 Years Experience, (802) 888-7194 

From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Allan
Sindelar
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 10:57 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] To stack or not to stack? Off-grid 240V

Hilton,
Kevin's comments are well taken. To add a bit:

Magnum are exceptionally easy to set up and program. The user interface is
well designed. A few issues to be aware of from my experience: 
- All of our Magnum-based off grid systems have been single inverter. At 4
kW, a single inverter may not be enough for that particular 3hp motor - best
to CYA with the customer on the possible need for a stacked pair. 
- Magnum allows a pretty wide voltage dip to accomplish surge capacity, so
when the saw starts, expect lights to flicker. Our CF bulbs flicker when the
refrigerator starts.

Our trial with Apollo a couple of years ago was probably the single most
negative experience with an inverter manufacturer of my career. Kevin's
comment that the most basic programming required hooking up to a computer is
accurate. The computer must have their proprietary software installed, and
the hookup was necessary even to initiate an equalize charge from an AC
source. We have several warranty replacement and takeout units on a shelf
here, from two installations (including in my own home) where the equipment
was replaced after being unable to get it to work reliably. Ultimately,
Apollo agreed in writing to reimburse us for the cost to replace their
equipment with another brand. They never came through. 

Allan

Allan Sindelar
 <mailto:Allan at positiveenergysolar.com> Allan at positiveenergysolar.com
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
Founder, Positive Energy, Inc.

A Certified B CorporationTM
3209 Richards Lane
Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
505 424-1112 office 780-2738 cell
 <http://www.positiveenergysolar.com/> www.positiveenergysolar.com

On 10/29/2013 10:32 PM, Kevin Pegg wrote:

Hi Hilton, 

My $0.05 worth as off-grid is my primary domain. 

The SW4024 is an excellent inverter, reliable, robust and if you can find
another stack them for 240 and will have no issues with the 3 HP table saw
(assuming batteries can handle that is). I run my whole home from a 13 year
old pair of them. 

Magnum makes an excellent, robust, and reliable off-grid inverter. Available
in 120 or 240 without stack. Stacking Magnums (for more power) is
straightforward and the user interface is very simple and intuitive. There
is some different hardware required for stacking. If a second SW4024 isn't
an option then this is what I would do. 

I test installed an Apollo unit last year. What a frustrating experience
that was. It requires a computer and a RS485 interface to program the most
basic features to make the unit usable. Nice when I was real remote and
without Internet. That alone makes it unappealing in my books. Seems they
are a bit behind the rest of the crowd. I'd not trust a marketing department
claim it will start that saw unless they can demonstrate it. (with of course
some other loads on the system - having to power down the house so one can
work in the shop is hardly usable). 

Outback units are common, though suffer from weak battery chargers and power
quality issues while under charge so for off-grid that involves any
significant generator charging they are not ideal. They are complex to
program and operate and end users report lots of frustration. 

Kevin

-----Original Message-----
From:  <mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org>
re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org [
<mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org>
mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org]On Behalf Of Hilton Dier
III
Sent: October 29, 2013 6:48 PM
To:  <mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] To stack or not to stack? Off-grid 240V

Hello Wrenches,

I have an off-grid client with a 24V system and an old Xantrex SW4024. He
wants 240VAC capability with enough oomph for sometimes making a cut with
his 3 hp table saw without starting the generator.

I am looking at Apollo, Magnum, and Outback inverters. I'm most familiar
with Outback. I have a couple of installations out there with stacked 3.6 kW
Outbacks.

However, the Apollo marketing promises that their 3.2 kW inverter will start
a 3 hp motor. Will it actually, and is this a good idea even if it can?

I'd appreciate hearing about your experiences with 240V Apollo units,
stacked Magnums, and stacked Outbacks. I know from experience that the
Outbacks require some hundreds of dollars of extra fittings and electronics
to make a proper stacked installation. How about Magnum? Any comments on
reliability?

Many Thanks,

Hilton 

-- 
Hilton Dier III
Renewable Energy Design
Partner, Solar Gain LLC
453 East Hill Rd.
Middlesex, VT 05602

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