[RE-wrenches] Trojan L-16 SG Readings- Did Something Change?

Tue Sep 4 14:21:23 PDT 2012

Wrenches,

o   Only water should be added during the life of Trojan flooded lead acid batteries.  Sulfuric acid should not be taken out of the battery, nor added.  Acid filling is done at Trojan factory. Any acid filling outside Trojan factory would be exceptional (accidental event) and per detailed revamping instructions from Trojan Tech Support.

>From our website: http://www.trojanbatteryre.com/Tech_Support/Tech_Support.html?tab=0#TabbedPanels1#top
Phone
Trojan telephone tech support is available Monday thru Friday, 7am to 5pm Pacific Standard Time.
US and Canada: 800.423.6569 ext. 3045
International: +1.562.236.3045

o   As noted by Bob Ellison earlier, S.G. readings shall be temperature compensated according to the temperature at the time of the readings.
Please see here: http://www.trojanbatteryre.com/Tech_Support/Tech_Support.html?tab=0#TabbedPanels1#top
2. Can I use the specific gravities to troubleshoot my battery?
The specific gravities of batteries are an excellent tool to determine the state of charge of batteries and their ability to accept a charge. Unfortunately, the specific gravities can also lead to an erroneous conclusion if we do not specify the conditions under which the measurements were taken. The two major sources of error in measuring specific gravities are lack of temperature compensation and water addition. Since the specific gravities of batteries are affected by temperature, the measurements must be temperature compensated. The best way to compensate for cold temperatures is to subtract four points from your reading for every 10º F (5.5º C) degrees below 80º F (27º C). To compensate for hot temperatures simply add four points from your reading for every 10º F (5.5º C) degrees above 80º F (27º C). Also, the addition of water should only be done once the batteries are fully charged as the electrolyte levels vary as a function of state of charge and are highest once the batteries are fully charged. Please use-distilled water only and note that adding water will lower the specific gravities of your batteries. The specific gravities cannot be used as a reliable source unless we account for the two sources of error mentioned above.

I hope the above helps.

John
John F. DeBoever
Global Technical & Projects Director - Renewable Energy
Trojan Battery Company

12380 Clark Street
Santa Fe Springs, CA 90670
Tel: +1-562-236-3000 Ext. 3139
Cell: +1-845-514-7600 - NY office time zone: USA EST (GMT-5)
Skype: john.f.deboever
Fax: +1-562-236-3239
jdeboever at trojanbattery.com<mailto:jdeboever at trojanbattery.com>
www.trojanbattery.com<http://www.trojanbattery.com/>

From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake
Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 4:24 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Trojan L-16 SG Readings- Did Something Change?

Could the battery acid solution be too weak?  I saw a problem once when some of the original acid had been taken out of the batteries and replaced by water.   What does the voltage look like? In that case, the voltage would never reach equalize voltage.

At 03:22 PM 9/4/2012, you wrote:

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Content-Language: en-us

Thank you John. Is anyone else out there seeing specific gravity measurements outside of what Trojan is stating on the spec sheets?

John, we are not seeing these SG readings, no matter how much we equalize, we are still seeing readings that are about .015+/- low after several equalizations. This is on newer batteries, and within the plate forming period. Do you have a SG reading that we should be looking for during the first 18 months (or XX amount of cycles until the plates are properly formed)?

Thanks-

Sequoya Cross
1589 Rapid Lightning Creek Rd
Sandpoint, Idaho 83864
www.backwoodssolar.com<http://www.backwoodssolar.com/>
Phone(208)263-4290
Fax (888) 273-8279

We are an online and catalog business that caters to off-grid and grid-tie customers, with technicians that own and operate a variety of renewable energy systems using the products that we sell. We take great pride in getting to know our products so that we can recommend the best for our customers.

From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org<mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org> [ mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of John DeBoever
Sent: Friday, August 31, 2012 1:05 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Trojan L-16 SG Readings- Did Something Change?

Sequoya, Wrenches,

Thank you for your patience on this, as I had no easy Internet connection. Below are the clarifications requested.

ü  Trojan Premium L16RE-B datasheet can be found here: http://www.trojanbatteryre.com/PDF/datasheets/L16REB_TrojanRE_Data_Sheets.pdf

ü  Trojan Premium line ( http://www.trojanbatteryre.com/PDF/Premium_Trojan_ProductLineSheet.pdf    ) has indeed changed its specific gravity from nominal 1.260+-0.007 to nominal 1,280+-0.007 since March 2012 production.  This change was motivated to reduce the confusion in the field between Trojan Premium line S.G. values and Trojan Signature line S.G. values.  They are now identical.  Only Trojan IND line S.G. remain at 1.260 .

ü  During the beginning of the life of the battery, an optimized development process of the plates porosity will take place to maximize the surface access contact between the electrolyte and the lead sulfate crystal within Trojan proprietary exclusive paste formulation.  This optimum moisture of the active material at the beginning of the battery life is the continuation of an advanced factory-controlled 72-hour curing process and increase the electrical conductivity and improved discharge performance of the active material paste, resulting in Trojan's proven both sustained capacity and total overall ampere-hours,  resulting in more operating power. The variation can reflect approximately 7 points in the S.G.

ü  The date code can be found on the negative terminal and consist of one letter and one figure.  The figure for 2012 is "2". Any date code from and after "E2"  (i.e. Code date with letter E2, F2, G2,...)
will have a nominal S.G. of 1.280 . Prior that, the nominal S.G. was 1,260.

I hope that helps,

John

John F. DeBoever
Global Technical & Projects Director - Renewable Energy
Trojan Battery Company

12380 Clark Street
Santa Fe Springs, CA 90670
Tel: +1-562-236-3000 Ext. 3139
Cell: +1-845-514-7600 - NY office time zone: USA EST (GMT-5)
Skype: john.f.deboever
Fax: +1-562-236-3239
jdeboever at trojanbattery.com<mailto:jdeboever at trojanbattery.com>
www.trojanbattery.com<http://www.trojanbattery.com/>

From: re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org<mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org> [<mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org> mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org ]<mailto:re-wrenches-bounces at lists.re-wrenches.org> On Behalf Of Sequoya Cross
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 3:08 PM
To: re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org<mailto:re-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org>
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Trojan L-16 SG Readings- Did Something Change?

We are wondering if anybody knows when the Trojan L-16RE-B batteries went from full SG readings of 1.265 (after an 18 month "plate forming" period) to 1.280 that they now state on the data sheet. We have been having customers use 1.250 as a full reading which would gradually increase over time to 1.265 and that might take/might not be seen for 18 months. Now we see that a "full reading" should be 1.280 and maybe still a "plate forming" period or maybe not? Does anyone know the date code that we can use with customers to see what they should be looking for (should have been somewhere between 2010 and 2012)? I have this question out to Trojan as well, but haven't received confirmation and wanted to know what data you all were seeing as well.

Thanks-

Sequoya Cross
1589 Rapid Lightning Creek Rd
Sandpoint, Idaho 83864
www.backwoodssolar.com<http://www.backwoodssolar.com/>
Phone(208)263-4290
Fax (888) 273-8279

We are an online and catalog business that caters to off-grid and grid-tie customers, with technicians that own and operate a variety of renewable energy systems using the products that we sell. We take great pride in getting to know our products so that we can recommend the best for our customers.

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