[RE-wrenches] Fwd: Apollo charge controllers
penobscotsolar at midmaine.com
penobscotsolar at midmaine.com
Tue Mar 23 16:53:46 PDT 2010
We installed the first two released Apollo T-80's on a job in the
Caribbean three years ago. I was out on that island two weeks ago and went
out to check on the system and it is still performing remarkably well. The
home is actually on a bluff overlooking the ocean with the BOS components
installed in a small blockhouse. Even with the extreme salt air and heat
these two controllers, and many others we have installed since then,
continue to perform very well. We had one issue with one that literally
"smoked" early on, but since then no other problems have arisen.
Daryl
> <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
> <html>
> <head>
> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
> <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)">
> <!--[if !mso]>
> <style>
> v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
> o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
> w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
> .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
> </style>
> <![endif]--><o:SmartTagType
> namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
> name="PostalCode">
> <o:SmartTagType
> namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
> name="State"><o:SmartTagType
> namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="City">
> <o:SmartTagType
> namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
> name="place"><o:SmartTagType
> namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
> name="PersonName">
> <!--[if !mso]>
> <style>
> st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }
> </style>
> <![endif]-->
> <style>
> <!--
> /* Font Definitions */
> @font-face
> {font-family:Helvetica;
> panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
> @font-face
> {font-family:Tahoma;
> panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
> /* Style Definitions */
> p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
> {margin:0in;
> margin-bottom:.0001pt;
> font-size:12.0pt;
> font-family:"Times New Roman";
> color:black;}
> a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
> {color:blue;}
> a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
> {color:blue;}
> span.EmailStyle17
> {mso-style-type:personal;
> font-family:Arial;
> color:navy;}
> span.EmailStyle18
> {mso-style-type:personal;
> font-family:Arial;
> color:navy;}
> span.EmailStyle21
> {mso-style-type:personal-reply;
> font-family:Arial;
> color:navy;}
> @page Section1
> {size:8.5in 11.0in;
> margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;}
> div.Section1
> {page:Section1;}
> -->
> </style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
> <o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
> <o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
> <o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
> </o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
> </o:SmartTagType></o:SmartTagType></o:SmartTagType></o:SmartTagType></o:SmartTagType>
> </head>
> <body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
> Wrenches, <br>
> As I sometimes do here, I sent a Wrench question about the monitoring
> function of the Apollo T80 controller to Apollo, with an offer to post
> a response. Here ya go. Note that the first paragraph of the answer is
> key; the rest is basic FAQ stuff for homeowners. In short: it works
> like a Tri-Metric, because that technology is incorporated into the T80
> under license.<br>
> Allan<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <div class="Section1">
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><b><font color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma; color: windowtext;
> font-weight: bold;">From:</span></font></b><font
> color="black" face="Tahoma" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma; color: windowtext;"> John
> Pfeifer <br>
> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, March
> 18, 2010
> 11:52 AM<br>
> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;"></span></b></span></font><font
> color="black"><span style="color:
> windowtext;"><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
> size="3"><span
> style="font-size: 12pt;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
> <font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
> navy;"><o:p></o:p></span></font><font
> color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">Here is the
> answer to your question in the
> form of an FAQ which we can clean up and then publish it on our
> website. <o:p></o:p></span></font>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
> navy;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
> navy;">Question:
> How
> does the State of <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:State
> w:st="on">Charge</st1:State></st1:place>
> energy meter determine when the battery is
> full?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
> navy;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">Answer:
> The
> State
> of <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:State
> w:st="on">Charge</st1:State></st1:place>
> readout
> or Energy Meter works exactly like the ever popular Tri-Metric meter
> from
> Bogart Engineering. Apollo Solar licensed the technology from Bogart
> Engineering so our T80 would display the same numbers as everyone’s
> Tri-Metric. When the T80 is first installed, it has no way of
> knowing the state of the battery so it displays ??? on the front panel
> LCD. The battery is charged through the normal cycles of Bulk
> and
> Absorb and when it finishes the Absorb stage, and the battery is full
> by definition,
> it goes into the Float stage. At this point, the T80 tells the
> internal State of <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:State
> w:st="on">Charge</st1:State></st1:place>
> software that the battery is at 100%. We often look at this
> like
> filling the gas tank of a car: the only way to really know that the gas
> tank is full is when the gas is dripping from the filler port.
> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
> navy;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">By the same
> gas tank
> analogy, when the T80 is set up it has to be told how many gallons the
> gas
> tank will hold. This is the Amp Hour capacity of the battery.
> There
> is some elegance in integrating the State of <st1:place
> w:st="on"><st1:State
> w:st="on">Charge</st1:State></st1:place> meter into the charge
> controller
> since only the charge controller knows exactly when the battery is full
> as it
> goes into the Float stage. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
> navy;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: navy;">While we are
> on the
> subject, we should describe how the Energy Meter follows the actual
> State of <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:State
> w:st="on">Charge</st1:State></st1:place>
> of the battery
> and why it is the best method. A current shunt is required in the
> system
> which is wired such that all the current that goes into and out of the
> battery
> must pass through it. Starting from the 100% full state at
> Float,
> the T80 software counts current that is discharged from the
> battery and subtracts it from the total Amp Hour Capacity that was
> programmed
> in as the full battery capacity. When the battery is charged,
> all
> the current going into the battery is measured and added to the
> total.
> Even though this running total can sometimes get a little off when the
> battery
> is old or has some weak cells, it is much better than measuring the
> battery
> voltage. First of all the running total is reset to 100% every
> time
> the battery goes into float mode. In order to get an accurate
> state
> of charge reading by measuring the battery voltage, all the charging
> sources
> and loads must be disconnected from the battery and it must rest for
> about 20
> minutes. Since this is not practical in a real installation, the
> battery
> voltage is often measured under load or while charging, which give
> totally
> erroneous readings. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 0.5in;"><font color="navy"
> face="Arial" size="2"><span
> style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
> navy;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
> size="3"><span
> style="font-size: 12pt;"><br>
> -------- Original Message -------- <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> <table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">
> <tbody>
> <tr>
> <td style="padding: 0in;" nowrap="nowrap" valign="top">
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: right;"
> align="right"><b><font
> color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
> style="font-size: 12pt; font-weight: bold;">Date:
> <o:p></o:p></span></font></b></p>
> </td>
> <td style="padding: 0in;">
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
> size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt;">Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:00:06
> -0700 (PDT)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </td>
> </tr>
> <tr>
> <td style="padding: 0in;" nowrap="nowrap" valign="top">
> <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: right;"
> align="right"><b><font
> color="black" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span
> style="font-size: 12pt; font-weight: bold;">From:
> <o:p></o:p></span></font></b></p>
> </td>
> <td style="padding: 0in;">
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
> size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt;"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
> href="mailto:toddcory at finestplanet.com"><u>toddcory at finestplanet.com</u></a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </td>
> </tr>
> </tbody>
> </table>
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Arial" size="4"><span
> style="font-size: 13.5pt; font-family: Arial;">I'm sure that's all
> cleared up for current versions,
> by now.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Arial" size="4"><span
> style="font-size: 13.5pt; font-family: Arial;">Now a couple of years
> later, we've had zero trouble,
> and we are running well over 70 amps
> continuous.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </div>
> <div>
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Arial" size="4"><span
> style="font-size: 13.5pt; font-family: Arial;">The wireless Trimetric
> meter option is a pretty good
> reason to use Apollo for off grid projects,
> too.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Times New Roman"
> size="3"><span
> style="font-size: 12pt;"></span></font><font face="Arial" size="4"><span
> style="font-size: 13.5pt; font-family: Arial;">So do the charge
> controller and amp hour meter communicate so they agree
> on when the batteries are fully charged?<br>
> <br>
> Todd<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <small><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">On Wednesday, March
> 17, 2010 12:02pm, "R Ray Walters" <a moz-do-not-send="true"
> href="mailto:ray at solarray.com"><u><ray at solarray.com></u></a>
> said:<br>
> <br>
> We have a couple out in the field. A bit of hassle to upgrade the
> firmware at
> first, but Apollo was very helpful, and sent us a free interface to do
> the
> update. <o:p></o:p></font></small>
> </span></font></p>
> <small><font color="black" face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"
> size="4"><small><span
> style="font-size: 13.5pt; font-family: Arial;"><font
> face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"><small>is a pretty good
> reason to use Apollo for off grid projects,
> too.</small></font><o:p></o:p></span></small></font></small>
> </div>
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><small><font color="black"
> face="Times New Roman, Times, serif" size="4"><small><span
> style="font-size: 13.5pt; font-family:
> Arial;"><o:p> </o:p></span></small></font></small></p>
> <div class="moz-signature"><span
> style="border-spacing: 0px; orphans: 2; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;">
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Helvetica" size="1"><span
> style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica;">R.
> Walters<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </div>
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Helvetica" size="1"><span
> style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica;"><a
> href="mailto:ray at solarray.com"
> moz-do-not-send="true"><u>ray at solarray.com</u></a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </div>
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Helvetica" size="1"><span
> style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica;">Solar
> Engineer<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
> </div>
> <div>
> <p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Helvetica" size="1"><span
> style="font-size: 9pt; font-family:
> Helvetica;"><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
> </div>
> <div></div>
> </span> <br>
> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; ">
> <meta name="ProgId" content="Word.Document">
> <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 11">
> <meta name="Originator" content="Microsoft Word 11">
> <link rel="File-List" href="signature_files/filelist.xml">
> <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
> <o:DocumentProperties>
> <o:Author>pe</o:Author>
> <o:LastAuthor>pe</o:LastAuthor>
> <o:Revision>2</o:Revision>
> <o:TotalTime>1</o:TotalTime>
> <o:Created>2009-12-09T22:29:00Z</o:Created>
> <o:LastSaved>2009-12-09T22:30:00Z</o:LastSaved>
> <o:Pages>1</o:Pages>
> <o:Words>52</o:Words>
> <o:Characters>298</o:Characters>
> <o:Company>pe</o:Company>
> <o:Lines>2</o:Lines>
> <o:Paragraphs>1</o:Paragraphs>
> <o:CharactersWithSpaces>349</o:CharactersWithSpaces>
> <o:Version>11.9999</o:Version>
> </o:DocumentProperties>
> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
> <w:WordDocument>
> <w:SpellingState>Clean</w:SpellingState>
> <w:GrammarState>Clean</w:GrammarState>
> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/>
> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>
> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent>
> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>
> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel>
> </w:WordDocument>
> </xml><![endif]--><!
> --[if gte mso 9]><xml>
> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156">
> </w:LatentStyles>
> </xml><![endif]-->
> <style>
> <!--
> /* Style Definitions */
> p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
> {mso-style-parent:"";
> margin:0in;
> margin-bottom:.0001pt;
> mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
> font-size:12.0pt;
> font-family:"Times New Roman";
> mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";
> color:black;}
> a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
> {color:blue;}
> a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
> {color:blue;}
> span.il
> {mso-style-name:il;}
> @page Section1
> {size:8.5in 11.0in;
> margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;
> mso-header-margin:.5in;
> mso-footer-margin:.5in;
> mso-paper-source:0;}
> div.Section1
> {page:Section1;}
> -->
> </style><!--[if gte mso 10]>
> <style>
> /* Style Definitions */
> table.MsoNormalTable
> {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";
> mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;
> mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;
> mso-style-noshow:yes;
> mso-style-parent:"";
> mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;
> mso-para-margin:0in;
> mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt;
> mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
> font-size:10.0pt;
> font-family:"Times New Roman";
> mso-ansi-language:#0400;
> mso-fareast-language:#0400;
> mso-bidi-language:#0400;}
> </style>
> <![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
> <o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="2050"/>
> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
> <o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
> <o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1"/>
> </o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
> <div class="Section1">
> <p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span class="il"><b
> style="">Allan</b></span><b
> style=""> Sindelar</b><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><br>
> <a href="mailto:Allan at positiveenergysolar.com" target="_blank"><span
> class="il">Allan</span>@positiveenergysolar.com</a><br>
> NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer<br>
> EE98J Journeyman Electrician<br>
> <b style="">Positive Energy, Inc.</b><br>
> 3201 Calle Marie<br>
> Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507<br>
> <b style="">505 424-1112</b><br>
> <a href="http://www.positiveenergysolar.com/"
> target="_blank">www.positiveenergysolar.com</a></span></p>
> </div>
> </div>
> </div>
> </div>
> </div>
> </body>
> </html>
> _______________________________________________
> List sponsored by Home Power magazine
>
> List Address: RE-wrenches at lists.re-wrenches.org
>
> Options & settings:
> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>
> List-Archive:
> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>
> List rules & etiquette:
> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
>
> Check out participant bios:
> www.members.re-wrenches.org
>
>
More information about the RE-wrenches
mailing list