[RE-wrenches] Ideal platform for flooded type batteries:opinions wanted

[frenergy]

Alan,

        Thanks for sharing all that, pretty similiar to my take on offgrid batt pack install.  Though I really like the idea of sloping the top to keep folks from putting stuff on it and thus avoiding that maintenance we all love to do.  I know I've been caught a couple times with my pants down whilst (sp?) the electrolyte a bit too low (how did that happen so fast??)

        I haven't had nearly as much luck getting batteries in kitchens, but have talked a few folks into building a battery "closet" to an exterior (uninsualted where the closet is) wall of a house...the other walls and it's exterior door of the closet being very well insualted.  Despite Bill Miller's thoughts about insulating a batt box, then venting being "pointless", well I don't agree.  The time when you need the batteries the warmest (winter) is when the powered vent would be on the least.  The vent is simply not venting that much in the winter, which of course will be determined somewhat by batt voltage settings to your powered vent, cross-sectional area of (adjustable?)vents and if you are relying on a non-powered venting system.  Personally, I've never set batts on concrete, that 2" rigid foam with plywood works like a champ.

        My most common favorite is the Wellhouse/battery/inverter/ with genny under the overhang (or also inside) shed.

        Also, clearly posting the requirements for maintianing the battery is critical with its partner - a calendar to document it, esp for those times when the customer, dumbfounded, fries their first pack and wants to blame anybody but themseves.  "and when was the last time you watered, bulked, EQ'ed your batteries?  I see, 2007"

        I assume "duct seal" around the cables heading towards the inverter is some high quality caulking?

Bill
Feather River Solar Electric
4291 Nelson St.
Taylorsville, CA  95983
530-284-7849/6544 fax

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Allan Sindelar 
  To: RE-wrenches 
  Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2010 9:42 PM
  Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Ideal platform for flooded type batteries:opinions wanted


  Each of us has developed our own solutions. I like to keep batteries in a tempered space, to maintain reasonable winter temperatures. Tempered doesn't mean thermostatic heat, but an insulated space with a trombe wall that holds 50F or more in winter is sweet. I often put batteries indoors in the living space and have never had a problem with either a homeowner or an inspector.

  We have cultivated a woodworker to build boxes for us. He knows what we want. I like plywood, because it's familiar, attractive, versatile, dimensionally stable, and strong. At my suggestion, our woodworker uses 1/2" "Baltic Birch" plywood from a woodworker's supply or better lumberyard. It has 9 thin plies, so is very stable, and it comes in 60" X 60" sheets, so it fits many battery sets without the waste created by 4' X 8' sheets. It's commonly used to make cabinet drawer carcases.

  The primary problem is that plywood rots in contact with acid, so the boxes are primered on all the inside surfaces to form an acid barrier, and a liner of 40 mil EPDM rubber, pond liner, or shower pan liner is placed in the bottom and about 7" up the sides with folded corners. Above this level we put inlet ventilation holes, typically 3 1-1/4" holes across the front. The exterior is painted or given a clear finish, or left for the homeowner.

  The box is caulked and carefully weatherstripped, using RCI neoprene. The lid is sloped, partly to draw vapors up toward the vent but mostly to discourage the owners from storing things on the box and forgetting maintenance. We build the carcase on a 3-1/2" high toe kick, like a kitchen base cabinet, so it's easy to lean over to add water. We use a piano hinge for the hinged top, with a level top rear portion as a surface to drill for the vent stack. If there are kids or grandkids, a lockable hasp is easy to add.

  With this approach we always include a 12V Power Vent inline in a 2" white PVC vent pipe to the outside. A shower drain hair screen gets trimmed down and used as an insect screen. The Power Vent runs off of a charge controller's auxiliary circuit.

  I use two concentric hole saws from opposite sides to create a 1/4" thick flange to fit a lock ring around a 1-1/2" or 2" battery conduit, with duct seal around the cables to keep gases out of the electrical equipment.

  I teach people (and post an instruction sheet inside the box lid) battery care, including where to fill cells to to avoid spillage or splattering.

  To each his own; this has worked well for us and our customers.
  Allan
  .

  <![endif]--> 
  Allan Sindelar
  Allan at positiveenergysolar.com
  NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
  EE98J Journeyman Electrician
  Positive Energy, Inc.
  3201 Calle Marie
  Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
  505 424-1112
  www.positiveenergysolar.com



  Mick Abraham wrote: 
    Hi, Mechanix~

    My "customer du monde" has a dirt floor in the battery space but he's willing to build something on which we could place his "wet" type batteries. 

    Concrete is strong but it also tends to begin dissolving when battery acid gets on it. Been there, seen that, didn't like it.

    Wood could be strong but what about the dissolving problem? Would pressure treated wood be better than white wood, redwood etc.?

    OR: what else would the group advise for a support structure?

    ************************************************************

    The above questions assume that whatever we do will probably get wet, but that may be too pessimistic. Could someone give me a mini-review of plastic trays which would protect whatever goes beneath? 

    I'm pretty sure polypropylene is the right type plastic but short of custom welding by a plastic fabricator...where can I find trays which fit OK with floor scrubber type battery case dimensions?

    Thanks all around,

    Mick Abraham, Proprietor
    www.abrahamsolar.com

    Voice: 970-731-4675

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