PV Environmental Payback Analysis [RE-wrenches]

[Wally Stahle]

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Wrenches

For those interested in the work of Howard Odum mentioned by Tom please
visit   http://www.dieoff.com/page232.pdf   for a  macro view of energy in
the big picture. The following lines are from the abstract/intro.

"Emergy is the available energy (exergy) of one kind previously required to
be used up directly and indirectly to make the product or service."

"Systems of nature and humanity on all scales are part of a universal energy
hierarchy, which is the network of energy transformation processes which
joins small scales to larger scales, and these to even larger scales......
Available energy (potential energy= exergy) at one level is used up in each
transformation process to generate a smaller amount at the next larger
scale."

"Calories of energy of different kinds are not equivalent in their
contribution to useful work.  Directly and indirectly it takes about 1000
kilocalories of sunlight to make one  kilocalorie of spatially dispersed
organic matter,
about 40,000 to make a kilocalorie of coal, about 170,000 to make a
kilocalorie of electrical power, and 10 million or more to support a typical
kilocalorie of human sevice.  The larger the scale, the higher the quality
of the energy, but the less there is of it.  There is less energy but more
emergy (spelled with an M to indicate embodied energy-my note) per unit in
valuable things."

While this heady subject is outside of the boundries of a "wrenches" list I
think for the purposes of our industry inside of an economic paradigm that
places the market in the position that god occupies in other paradigms (as
in 'it is gods will') then I agree the energy payback justifies PV on
economic grounds in a world where the PV critics don't ask what the energy
payback (or costs) of an SUV, a tank, or a water heater are.

Wallace Stahle
Future Electric Energy Co
P O Box 236
Willits, CA 95490
707-459-0474
wstahle at pacific.net
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Lane, Energy Conservation Services" <tom at ecs-solar.com>
Subject: Re: PV Environmental Payback Analysis [RE-wrenches]

> Sorry the truth is there has never been a net energy gain ever in the
total
> embedded energy of manufacturing  a pv module .There never has  been
> manufactured a  pv module  that will result in a net energy gain
compared
> to he energy embedded in mining glass aluminum etc --- please review the
> work of  HowardOdum..............gator tom

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