Let's learn (was None of this is documented )(was Uplift Wind Loading Values) [R

[Bill Brooks]

Joel,

This is not a personal attack against you or your work. The point was made
that if you do your homework, things will work out properly. Unfortunately,
the real world doesn't always work that way, and we find out that even with
the best minds involved, bad things can happen.

I offer you the latest Space Shuttle mishap. Hindsight is 20:20, but the
crew is dead and nothing can bring them back. People may point fingers, but
that won't bring them back either.

The fact that problems at SMUD are not officially documented should come as
no surprise. The concern that you raise about foes of solar is valid and
real. So how do we discuss problems without getting defensive with each
other as wrenches withing the industry.

You say that I am knowledgeable and sincere--then you must believe that I
tell the truth as well. These are things that I have seen with my own
eyes--I would be lying if I said otherwise. The issue is: Here is a method
of roof mounting that has flaws--here are the flaws--here is how to solve
the problem so it does not cause a problem.

You have to agree that this type of discourse is healthy in the right
context. We definitely do not want to air our dirty laundry to our foes, but
if we can't speak about them in this forum, how do we learn?

Bill.

-----Original Message-----
From: Joel Davidson [mailto:joeldavidson at earthlink.net]
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2003 7:01 AM
To: RE-wrenches at topica.com
Subject: Re: None of this is documented (was Uplift Wind Loading Values)
[RE-wrenches]


Bill,

You are a knowledgeable and sincere PV engineer and people listen to your
opinion. If you want to give do (sic) respect to my work, then give it.

Undocumented claims about PV problems do more harm than good. Undocumented
claims about PV problems give Foes or Solar, legislators and the general
public
the impression that PV is not ready for prime time.

For the record, my work for SMUD has had no leaks.

Sincerely,
Joel Davidson, IEEE Member
http://www.ieee.org/portal/index.jsp?pageID=corp_level1&path=about/whatis&fi
le=code.xml&xsl=generic.xsl



Bill Brooks wrote:

> Joel,
>
> My point goes back to your first message on Saturday (copied below). You
> were making a case for why your design for SMUD was good and no leaks had
> occurred. I was pointing out my first-hand experience with this design.
The
> fact that this design was implemented at PVUSA after your contract was
over
> and after you left Solec does not impact the relevance of the design.
>
> The design was okay for that day and time, but it has been shown in
> practical experience to have problems. My experience with your design that
> was implemented at SMUD has convinced me to recommend against similar
ideas
> based on the weakness seen in the field. We live and learn.
>
> With all do respect, your mounting system did have much fewer failures
than
> the first round design using the old NorthEast RES roofjack design with
wood
> screws. SMUD had to retrofit numerous mounting systems of that generation
> because they were literally falling off peoples roofs. Wood screws were
> pulling out of the OSB and the roof jacks were rolling over.
>
> None of this is documented because it is not good news--and the rule was
> "all the news that's good enough to print." I attended several
presentations
> by various presenters that said that SMUD never had any mounting
> problems--that's just not accurate information.
>
> Airing this information should not be seen as dangerous, but rather an
> opportunity to learn and move on. For far too long, our industry has
focused
> on just telling the good stories. We need to tell the bad ones too so that
> we don't keep making the same mistakes. I don't enjoy contradicting your
> assessment and it is not in the least bit personal. My information clearly
> shows shortcomings to the design that needed to be stated.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Bill.
>

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